Debra Chapman asked, "Does anyone actually KNOW Ed?" Yes, I do. I've actually met him twice; once at a ferret club meeting and once at (and in) his home. He sort of looks like a demented Santa with twinkling eyes, red nose and everything (and I looked like his dwarf). I've seen his car proclaiming ferrets, him wearing his WWI German army helmet, seen his ferrets digging in his yard, actually seen his ferret room, his rescued mink, his bird, and his wacky (yet functional) method of naming kits. He is a real person and actually a very nice guy. Really. My visit showed me Ed is very proud of his ferrets, his home, his German heritage, and his ability to irritate other people into thinking about things that wouldn't normally cross their mind. I don't always agree with him, and on occasion he has really ticked me off, BUT I respect him and value his experience with ferrets. Ed is older than the average person found on the FML and he has the ability to ask a really good question in such a way as to get the maximum possible number of people upset. I think some people misunderstand his intentions because of the generational language he uses. Well, at least some of the time. ;-) I think we all know more about domestication, eugenics and breeding, the need for ferret activities, and other ferret stuff (not to mention HIV and Gay issues) because Ed's comments spurred debate and information exchange. What is wrong about that? I've taught my kids from day one that there are NO dumb questions; just dumb answers and even dumber answerers. Asking ANY question, even those not in question format, should never be attacked, flamed or ridiculed. I tease Ed in some of my answers, and a couple of times I've even called him on the carpet (in mostly a nice way), but I would NEVER want Ed to think I disliked him or wanted him to shut up or quit. Ed loves his ferrets, takes good care of them, breeds them carefully and places them responsibly, and makes us all think from time to time. If some of his opinions are different from someone elses, so what? I personally would never want to live in a world of perfect gingerbread people, all stamped out with the same opinions and desires (unless they are mine, of course). Sometimes Ed might have dated facts from obsolete science, but who knows everything? I don't (I know; its shocking), and I know in 30 years MY science will be outdated. Hell, by NEXT YEAR, much will be obsolete. Ed may be wrong from time to time, but from my experience, he seems to learn. And that's the point, right? Isn't that what the FML is all about? By the way. Have you ever noticed that sometimes the least tolerant of people are sometimes the ones who demand the most tolerance? Only a fool expects understanding and tolerance while bashing others. You know, maybe Ed *IS* an insensitive WWII era wacko who dislikes gays and should be strung on a Maypole and tied up by Fairies, but isn't that his right, just as it is for some people to dislike homophobes? Besides, this isn't a [List Your Oppressed Minority Here] mailing list; its a FERRET mailing list. We are here for fellowship, learning and exchanging information, and promoting ferrets and their welfare. The ferrets could care less if a Deaf Gay Pagan KKKer with tatoos of buttercups on their butt gave them thier raisin or scratched their ears. And neither should we, which, by the way, includes tolerance of insensitive WWII era wackos who dislikes gays. I went back and re-read some of Ed's statements which caused the uproar, and I'll be honest. I just didn't see them as gay bashing. I tried, but really didn't. I DID see someone with little understanding of HIV issues, but wasn't he asking questions? Didn't he ask for advice? Isn't that what this forum is for? I might be an Overeducated Evolutionist Short Mongrelized Middle-Aged Anglo-Saxon Straight White Male Protestant, but I know that if someone asks ME for toleration, they damn well better not be calling me names while they are asking. And I'm a Quaker, bred for toleration (and cool hats like on the oatmeal box). Are you any different? I will tell you something else; a little secret. Sometimes a good way to make people think is to challenge their beliefs and make them mad enough to write, get out good information, or even <gasp> make positive changes. Think about that the next time you reach for the keyboard after Ed has ticked you off; you might have been just manipulated into getting good information out to the masses. Of course, I could be wrong and Ed could just be an insensitive, crazy old fart who likes to stir up trouble and spread mischief, then gleefully giggle at the resulting chaos. I don't think so. Ed? Are you giggling? Ed? Bob C and 16 Mo' Tolerant Terrors (Missing Apollo, Crystal and Moose) [Posted in FML issue 2723]