Hey - this seems to be a nice debate (and hopefully non-flamable)! Interesting to learn how other's animals act and react & how us humans deal with it. >From: Edward Lipinski <[log in to unmask]> >Subject: Simultaneous housing of paired viripotent hobs >although not yet sexually mature, more frequently than not , assumed the >doggie style mating postion relative to his cage sharer and would hold him >by the loose skin fold on the back of his neck for hours as a time. My in-laws have 4 ferrets - Mitts, a rescue female; Andy - a male that came with a jill we purchased (one of her kits - already altered at 4 weeks = ( ); Beau - a male we bred; and Whatchie - a male we bred & was returned due to financial reasons. All animals are altered. They all got along great until one day we heard a shrill whine from their cage. Andy (the (cringe) 4 week old alter) who is now a year old had Whatchie (altered at 8 months or so) who is now a year old also by the scruff of the neck in the same (as Ed put it) "doggie style" position. He just held him there & wouldn't let go. He left scabs from the holding grip, but didn't inflict other wounds. The ferrets were separated into different cages and are now fine together again. Remember, the male ferret doing this was ALTERED EARLY. Why would he be showing sexual behavior towards another altered ferret? We figured it may be jealousy as this boy gets jealous easy. Maybe this was his way of telling my in-laws he wanted more attention? >However, the mitigation here is that the brothers have grown up together. We also have hobs that grew up together - not brothers but raised like brothers - and they do not squabble with each other. In fact, when out to play while in rut, they seem to greet each other like they missed one another. >The second hob you pick up will get very, very agitated upon scenting the >first hob's odor on you and your clothing, will frequently start digging at >your clothing with his powerful forepaw claws, and whamo! he'll nail you >"real good" unless you control his head or distract him with a chicken leg >or a bottle of Ferretone. My boys don't do this - jealous ferrets that don't give kisses maybe, but never mean to ME (other ferrets maybe) & NEVER have I been bitten by one of my current boys (except when they were silly kits). I believe I am more apt to get nailed from a hormonal jill with kits! I do have a boy that I do not trust quite yet & he is always handled with care - but he is an import & still a kit yet. If I have a hob that acts irrationally (not normal hob behavior - biting humans as Ed describes) is not tolerated. Off to the vet they go. As many people know temperament *is* inherited to a point & I am breeding for temperament & conformational correctiveness. Therefore - bad whole boys become good altered boys. I don't want nasty hobs or have to be worried that somebody is gonna get bit. I always let people hold my boys when they come to see my ferrets. That way they can get to know the sire of the ferret they are interested in & get an idea of what the kit may grow up to be like. As a former breeding manager of horses, I have a saying - "Being a breeding animal is a privilege. I don't care how pretty you are, how your offspring look, or if you have championships galore - if you are an a**hole to handle you're done". I have seen out of control breeding animals injure or kill their handlers. A stallion we had in for training & breeding reared up and hit the handler in the head with his front hoof - knocking the handler unconscious. He was castrated the next day (he used to lunge at people also). Sweetest horse you ever knew afterwards. >I must always warn such an individual that he's at serious risk of being >bitten and quite hard at that. When at my place I warn everybody when holding or inserting fingers in cages to scratch noses or ears. Even if I know that ferret would never bite I still warn - all animals are unpredictable, humans included. Used to be in MI my ferret's life if somebody was bit & reported it. Amy Flemming Flemming Farms http://www.geocities.com/heartland/ranch/9521 [log in to unmask] ~For every action, there is an equal and opposite criticism~ [Posted in FML issue 2387]