I will offer this background. When I was introduced to ferrets, I was pro Marshall Farms: they have cute ferrets, of which I purchased several. But as a scientist/practitioner I have a well cultivated curiosity. So I began to investigate this large(the largest supplier)ferret farm and their practices. It would have been very comforting to find information that supported my original belief. Unfortunately, several years later, this was not to be. I can tell you I have listened to many over the years, pro and con, and have found friends and apparent "enemies" on both sides. Egos proliferate in this arena, as many can attest, and "camps" form great divides. I have refused to "join" any of these camps to maintain a minimum of bias and some distance. My efforts are known to some, and so has my promise of anonymity and confidentiality which has afforded me a great deal of information from every type of source you can think of. Some good, and some not so good. I have had the privilege of hearing from and/or interviewing AFA breeders, numerous insiders and outsiders, past negotiators, shelter operators, NY employees, other breeders, large and small, various ferret orgs., and so on, and so on, always inviting more. The problem isn't just confirmation"(in some cases, this was actually possible), but *proving* the case. As you are probably aware, the OJ trial is just one good example of proving a "controversial" case, which Marshall Farms and Marshall Research certainly represent. I wish I had more time to devote to this, and I wish some egos did not muddy the water. Ah, if wishes were.... Actually Jazmyn, many breeders or would-be breeders have a stake *in* Marshall's existence, as I stated earlier, Marshall is partly championing the fight in CA which would only open the market for many and they have almost single handedly promoted the whole idea of ferrets / as pets! No other ferret mill, farm, or breeder comes anywhere close to Marshall's gross sales, size, and production, and capital. For these reasons, many have looked the other way. They are two entirely different markets though, small breeders are NO competition for Marshall, and visa versa. Marshall's closest competitor would probably be Path Valley Farms, and these two have little in common. So you see, Jazmyn, it is no where near as simplistic a problem as your argument suggests. I only wish it were. Damn, there I go again.... Almost finally, >Before you post your outage at MF, your defense of them, or anything else >related to this thread, you should realize that this has all been posted >here before - many times before. We've seen all the same information, >misinformation, rumors, emotion, and so on in regards to MF and MF practices >before. >Kimberly Burkard Yes, Kimberly, many of us, some *more* than others, but I'm sure BIG can attest to new members coming onboard regularly. So, just like the one thousandth litter question, this too will come up again and again. In order to protect our sanity, *and* especially BIG's, these cycles must be limited from time to time. Proponents are often accused of being Marshall mouthpieces, and opponents are often labeled as MF "bashers". While all of us see the posts, some would be shocked to see what goes on behind the scenes. Unfortunately for BIG, Xanax does NOT come in ten pound tablets! Even with all my training and experience, I'd probably resort to a little "slap therapy". For the ferrets, always for the ferrets. Kimberly, just because the thousands of ferrets within Marshall's confines have no names, do we offer any less assistance time and time again than for the single pet that does? Really, really finally, Thanks to the efforts of some, it is known that Marshall does monitor this forum. You know, probably over half the members on this forum have at least one Marshall ferret. However, Marshall has yet to participate constructively and informatively, in this, the largest of ferret forums. It makes you all the more appreciative of the vets, techs, shelters, breeders, orgs., and owners that do; and by doing this, subject themselves to scrutiny and ask nothing in return, a practice Marshall appears to avoid. There are some tough questions we need to ask, not only of the Marshalls, but of ourselves. best wishes, until next time, alphachi [Posted in FML issue 2222]