Hello, I have seen lots of folks write in about the use of scruffing for ferrets. I am sure that that would be effective, but, I was trained as a lab animal technician years ago. This was really helpful when I first got my ferrets. Most rat restraint holds are effective on ferrets. A scruff is a somewhat uncomfortable short term hold, and one that they can skirm a lot in. Often, in a scruff, they can either shake free or turn and bite. I used a restraint hold rather than a scruff on my sunshine. This hold consists of: firmly (but not tightly) grasping the ferret, your index and middle fingers on either side of the head (immobilizing it, especially good for bitey ferrets) and the thumb and ring fingers about their middle behind the forelegs. I think that if you try a time-out in this position you may be pleasantly surprised at the results. Our rule was that they remained in time-out until they had remained totally immobile for 10 seconds. At first, it took quite a while to satisfy this criterion (up to 3 minutes). If you put them down before they satisfy this criterion, *you are training them to struggle by reinforcing it*. Now, (they are 6 and 2 years old) they respond to this restraint with a learned helplessness response (I know I can't do *anything* until you put me down). If I hold them any other way (even just a finger out of place) they are their normal skirmy selves. But, this position means business. It is also effective for the annual vet visits. Neither of the ferrets have any opportunity to misbehave or fear bite at the vet. My two are also very snuggly ferrets... I haven't any idea if this is related to our training methods (I am a behavioral ecologist and my husband a psychologist) or we are just lucky! Give it a try... let me know how it works!! --() ______ Kari Toyer / o) \ / \ _ (and Sunshine!!) <____ \ / \ \\ \ \_/ \ \\ (402) 472-6643 \ __ \ _// [log in to unmask] \ / \ ( )_/ ||`--' \__\ | _|| _\| "Ferrets have two modes: asleep... and in trouble!!" [Posted in FML issue 1109]