Trish, time to get her in to the vet and have testing done. The primary thing you will be looking for is insulinoma but other possibilities exist. Do not put her in cool water, please, unless your vet has okayed it. Sometimes in a compromised ferret that can cause too rapid cooling, which itself can be dangerous. I apologize for coping an edited post I wrote to someone else in the FHL but I have barely had time to even sleep recently, so here it is: Usually when someone writes that a person can bet that a CBC with chemistry panel was not done. The most common cause for those symptoms is insulinoma, and what you describe sounds classic. BUTt you can't assume that it is insulinoma and just start treating because it could be other things including diabetes, so test first. Strokes have not been documented in ferrets, but some throw clots as complications to certain serious illnesses. This isn't a good match, though There are other possible causes. Here are just two, but they also don't really seem to be as good a match as a blood glucose problem to me: ADV, called hypergammaglobulinemia there as often as its called ADV, can have versions with neuro symptoms. The test is easy. Meninigitis is a possibility but incredibly rare. So, test and please don't wait because a more severe response is possible. If the ferret perks up when sugar syrup is placed on the gums during this sort of attack then it is virtually always insulinoma. (BTW, sometimes conditions that are less responsive to treatment than insulinoma -- like lympho or carcinoma in the pancreas -- can occur. The two cases we have personally had like that presented suddenly and in life-threatening form, though, not with the short of small seizures you describe.) Look at these general references: http://www.afip.org/ferrets/PDF/insulinoma.pdf and http://www.miamiferret.org/fhc/insulinoma.htm --- Carol, could you share the info on the small ferret with more details so that the unusual features can be pictured? If you are an FHL member you can put the little on into a photo album there and ask the questions, then direct people to it your posts to the FMl and FHL by giving the URL. We host only ferret health photos. It used to be that in the standard usage tiny individuals below a certain size were termed to be midgets and ones with caused of small stature that could cause disproportionate limb sizes were termed dwarfs. For instance, our Ruffle who had very short limbs and a large-normal body, with a very flat face, very long and lush fur, early arthritis, and multiple deformities and handicaps was diagnosed by two vets (treating vet and a pathologist) as someone with achrondroplastic dwarfism accompanied by those additional problems. Recently, I have noticed that in some human sites the term "dwarf" has been extended to cover those previously termed "midgets". Heck, they know more than I do on the subject; we have a lot of small family members on Dad's side but they are larger with most are between 4'8" and 4'11" which isn't very small at all (and one of the ancestral described-as-small past ones in my family was one of Washington's generals and a spy in the Revolution and a brave and described-as-nervous tiny man who helped save the French fleet with the Setauket Spies... He was Woodhull, also known as Culpepper senior from a secret identity. Just pointing out that some common viewpoints about "small" or about "nervous" just don't hold water. I'm sure not that brave or accomplished!) There are a range of possible causes of small stature, and not all are genetic. There can be dietary input, too, for instance from starvation, from rickets due to getting too much meat and too little calcium, etc. I'd like to know more about this little one. What does the treating vet say? I think that I would be inclined to opt for x-rays in the least, and possibly for ultrasound or other additional tests depending on what the treating vet says since his breathing worries you. Is the ribcage deformed at all? Skull shape normal or not? Guessed age? I have certainly seen some kits with very big feet who grew into them. Can you ask the vet to consult with someone in genetic med? The private octopus (Title for a short story?): it sounds like there was just a classic miscommunication. It sounds like the person at that point was only requesting a photograph (or a URL with a photograph) to see what the toy looks like before deciding whether to buy, but because a pattern had been earlier requested before she realized it was patented it was thought that a pattern was still be requested instead of a photo. Maybe things weren't worded well, or weren't read well, or both. Sounds eminently fixable as a situation. Then again, maybe I'm not reading well, or the things I read weren't written well, or... (Oh, my brain is so fried from too little sleep for too many days with too much work...) Sukie (not a vet) Ferret Health List co-moderator http://www.smartgroups.com/groups/ferrethealth FHL Archives fan and regular user http://fhl.sonic-weasel.org International Ferret Congress advisor http://www.ferretcongress.org [Posted in FML issue 4979]