> Since that has been mentioned for years I hope more sites catch up. --- I have tons of documents on file that are very up to date on the Deaf Ferrets egroup at Yahoo. One can access that archive at deaf_ferrets at yahoogroups. I can't remember if I have it set up so that the general public can access those files or if you have to join. If you must join, you can opt to not have messages sent to you at all. You will be able to read posts and have full access to the site however. There are things written by Brett Middlton, Leigh Whittaker, you (Sukie) and I forget who else on file there. Now if I can only put an adjunct page up to my deaf ferret site based on all of that info, I'd be happy. I wish I could have done so FOUR years ago. I was offered help to at least update the out of date text on my deaf ferrets page. I don't know how to do websites off of yahoo, so I can't fix it myself. As far as taking up someones offer of help, I just have to not be so shy is all. I need to knock out the words WS on the site, substitute it for Neural Crest, then just list the common disorders under the NC (WS, KIT, etc, and associated affected genes). At least it would be more accurate. Scooby? If you are reading this, can you help me? I need someone to help. All I'd be doing is changing the text. Maybe I'd be less embarrassed to accept that help now. >That's not good news, actually. Oncogenes can increase the malignancy >risk for an individual. There are other risks as well. --- And lifespan seems a bit shortened for the most part. But anedoctally, I've noticed that malignancy rates sure aren't what I'd expect in affected ferrets in light of that. I mean that's how I percieve things. I am just not seeing a super high cancer rate in them like I'd expect. Thoughts? Opionions? >This is why there is a higher rate of certain cardiovascular problems, >including both cardiomyopathy types, but especially the harder to find >(before death) hypertrophic cardiomyopathy.(You can find some articles on >this in the archives of Ferret-Genetics in Yahoogroups and elsewhere.) --- Really? I wasn't noticing. I guess I need to pay attention more in the genetics group lol. I sure never thought to ask about cardiomyopathies related in my old deaf ferrets survey that I put up. However, out of the 500 responses, I don't remember that being a cause of death for the most part. >Some of these circulatory problems result in small litters due to >reabsorbed dead fetuses, or litters with a number of members who die >soon after birth due to increasing the circulatory malformation fetal >death rate. There can also be a higher newborn death rate due to deaf >ferret mothers not getting all of the signals they need for rapid and >correct responses. Multiple breeders have discussed encountering these >problems, and there is a lot in the literature on this in an assortment >of mammals. --- Yeah, a ton of literature. I strongly suspect cardiac defect is far more common than what we think. I think that maybe cardiac malformations are so gross that there is fetus absorption, still births, and high kit mortality due to this very thing (as you just said). Of course, there are developmental defects overall, so I could be wrong. But in kits that just die suddenly, there seems to be nothing obviously wrong at times. A cardiac problem would be very hard to detect in a necropsy. Most of the time there is never a necropsy anyway. >BTW, I have found myself wondering after many discussions if knee >patches may at times have a different genetic cause. --- Why? Due to the fact that it can occur without other (or many other) white depigmentation? I think the reason that I suspect that they are part of some sort of neural crest disorder is because I've never seen them before as a kid. Neural Crest disorders and odd white markings ... well, I never saw them once as a small child. Also, in the past ten years, they seem to be present on so many ferrets ... and the rate seems to parrallel the rate of obvious kit/ws markings that I see (and rarely do you ever see them seperate from other white markings). I'm really starting to think that the little patches, and such are a washed out versian of a neural crest defect. In other words, I think the gene pool is polluted ... sadly. I think there is so much of the gene pool affected from large farms and overzealous small breeders aiming towards fancies that even though they are trying not to purposefully breed for them now, it has bled over into many lines. Wolfy http://wolfysluv.jacksnet.com [Posted in FML issue 4834]