I don't know any way to say this delicately. There are some FML members (NOT us) who have helped their own ferrets over the bridge, or who even still do help their own ferrets over the bridge using older methods. I do NOT think that anyone should do these things, nor that they are the right thing to do. There are those here who do, though. Now, in the old days everything from guns, to drowning (which a grandfather did to one of my kittens), to hitting the animal over the head with a shovel, to worse were used, some very painful and frightening. It may be that if a second party has been told by a person that he or she has helped ferrets cross the bridge without a vet that the second party may know only of the techniques which older relatives used and may automatically think of those rather than another old method used by the person, just as i would first recall poor Blackie, the kitten whom my parents thought made too much of a mess, and drowning, even though a person helping a family member over the bridge may not use drowning. Back then such techniques were used because people were simply used to using them, or to save money (sometimes by people whose lifestyle indicated that they could very well afford vet care), and I suspect because the gentler methods of euthanasia perhaps just weren't available. I have to also say that we do have our ferrets examined before euthanasia. Like some others here we have had individuals for whom a new or even experimental technique was tried when all other cards had been played. In some cases those gave a decent chunk of quality time before the final euthanasia shot was needed. This possibility as well as the gentleness of the vet helped crossings are why we use vets always for such departures. We also have been in the position where we needed to wait a day or two with the ferret going through a rough spot because there was a chance the worsening of the problem might resolve itself. When our ferret family members have euthanasia we hold them as they drift off into unconsciousness from their first shot. Steve then afterward always leaves before they have their final shot (or once an overdose of gas) because he just can't deal with that. I am sometimes there and sometimes not during the final shot, depending on how I am holding up. I think that there has been a lot of upset back and forth with almost no one knowing the full story on either side and that it's likely best to just realize how little any of us know and to avoid drawing and stating conclusions, knowing that we don't have full enough details, and maybe with this sort of topic which would upset but not change that not having details maybe just as well. I personally don't like to see anyone telling another when to use euthanasia though because my personal experience is that those are the most painful notes a person can receive. I tried to be as gentle as is possible. I hope that folks realize that even though it seems impossible to some (most?) here that there are members who do or who have helped their own ferrets cross that it actually does happen, and that knowing that this happens and has happened can affect what might be said in a discussion. [Posted in FML issue 4493]