If the ferrets with the genetic problems were culled and efforts were made to cull such lines from breeding then that is actually good, if the problem is likely genetic. If diet or disease then that has to be investigated and handled right. I have nothing against culled ferrets with medical problems finding loving adoptive homes; we provide and have provided such a home ourselves. It's what should be done. If the same structural defects keep cropping up, though, then more still needs to be done. There are some very real problems with wire bottom cages being used by breeders or others and there are people here on the FML who have done rescues of such individuals who can give details of some of the very sad results including amputations, or a person can read them in back FML issues. Housing pigs with ferrets if anyone is doing it (or still doing it) is not a smart practise. Ferrets get influenza and can have a rough time with it (Can die of it.) plus are prone to secondary infections when they get it. Pigs are influenza carriers as are humans; that makes two possible sources of contagion. I know that people sometimes wonder why so many influenza strains begin in places like China. It is because of influenza strains that are present on small and crowded farm swhich have humans, pigs, and susceptiple poultry and then cross-over from one to another since each of these has a good tendency tohouse such cross-overs. There are possibly other shared disease which make the housing the pigs with ferrets evenmore a practise to be avoided. DO think that these places should be visited with descriptions and photos to clear the air, but we have heard here form people who have seen photos or have handled the animals so that aspect has to be considered seriously. Things could go in either direction depending on openness to learning, and the topics discusses could lead to something better than the norm if taken seriously by anyone, or worse if not. I think the things discussed could help ANY breeder who wants tolearn. Good people do, so that is hopeful. Am exhausted. Please, forgive that. Pat wrote: >Unfortunately, people fall for stuff like this all the time. They rarely >stop and think, or do some research first. Rare or unusual looking >animals, they just have to have them at any cost. A few months later they >are in a vet's office with all kinds of medical problems, yelling at some receptionists about their bill which they think is unfair because they paid >so much for the pet. Not the vet's fault. Many wind up being dumped or >neglected because the people no longer want to spend money on them. and >Lately on the FML there has been a shelter count for an entirely different >reason, but it came with perfect timing. It should be an eye opener. Just >at first glance, not even going into detail (I am sure there were plenty I >missed) in just 10 shelters there were 419 ferrets waiting for homes. Sadly, that gets much of it down in a nutshell. PLease, folks, ADOPT at least some of your crew! As for anyone's breeding and purchasing demands: Health, longevity, and personality first! PLEASE! I think that the discussion of this topic and it's various aspects is helping to TEACH BREEDERS and to TEACH THOSE WHO MAY PRCHASE FROM ANYWHERE. As such it is preventing heart-break and avoiding future health problems for ferrets from who knows how many sources of breeeding stock. Easier to avoid problems by learning, discussing, and taking logical and responsible actions thanit is to correct them once they exist. Perhaps the discussion avoided soem whoppers at multiple places and benefited us all as a result. certianly the info on what too much taurine might do is new for us all. It's also been very civil except for a very few letters. MOst have taken the "wait and see" attitude in relation to the futures of the three (or was it more?) breeders who got emphasized, but felt that the topics in general were worthy of general discussion and learning, and that things could turn any way for at least one of those families. Tanya wrote: >It has been mankind that has taken this *hobby* to limits of overbreeding, >inbreeding, and proliferation for the sake of the perfect animal. True, and that is what people are hoping to make different for ferrets ( byu empasizing health, longevity, and personlity and urging that these be the primary focus) in relation to other domestics whcih have so many inbred probelems. Looks are in the noise, or SHOULD BE. Things that undermine health like osteological malformations, handicaps, etc. are not fair to impose on ferrets fof the sake of a look. and she added: >But to me the *beautiful/gorgeous/perfect* ferret is the one that is >healthy, happy, and well cared for. Exactly! Randy aasks what good is a ferret shelter? To us they are GOOD as places to get wodnerful addtions fto our family who tend to remain grateful thier entire lives. (Fine for info and friends, too) Hope I can get a nap today. [Posted in FML issue 3212]