>Feces and urine drop through the wire floor to the ground. And when the USDA certification allows a 900 pound (more or less) pig to clean up the urine and feces, the USDA loses credibility. Will someone who has seen the living conditions and first hand care of the Kit and Caboodle ferrets please report here so we can all sleep a little easier? With all of you who have met the Cole's, surely one of you have been to Tennessee to see their operation. "USDA inspected" and show ribbons are not enough for me so I'd sure like facts rather than speculation. >The AFA president said she has talked to them many times, they are good >Christian people who care deeply for their ferrets. arghh. Are you saying that because I'm agnostic/aethiest, I'm not a person who cares for my ferrets OR that being christian automatically makes a person qualifed to be proper ferret caretakers? Sorry, I don't buy that. Some of the most horrific living conditions for ferrets I've ever known of have been at the homes of christians and one of the most compassionate shelters is run by agnostic/aethiests. Religion has absolutely no place in the discussion about providing proper care for ferrets. You may be christian and you may care deeply for ferrets but there is no automatic pass from one to the other. What matters in breeding & showing 300+ ferrets are things like the knowledge of ferrets in general, knowledge of breeding and genetics, ability to provide for and pay for the proper care of ferrets (including someone who is knowledegable to take care of the ferrets while you not on site), providing veterinary care from a ferret knowledgeable vet, responsibility in taking care of the retired or culled breeders, responsibility to the ferret community in supporting health, legal, and welfare issues, etc. >they have now been given a ringing endorsement by the president of the >American Ferret Association. Please assure us that the AFA is endorsing the Cole's because of their knowledge about ferrets & ferret breeding and after a personal visit to Tennessee and not because of their religious stance. {Soapbox off} -Carla (proudly agnostic and a great ferret mom!) [Posted in FML issue 3210]