>Subject: zen: bill's opinions on the AFA and the abuse incident We have been reluctant to enter into this discussion due to some other issues we have with certain officers of the AFA. They are not directly related to this incident from the most recent show but they are a part of a continuing pattern including how this incident was handled. We will end up discussing several points without directly citing where they were brought up. We were not at the NJ show and did not personally witness this incident and did not feel it appropriate to discuss the incident only based on second hand knowledge. But Ms. McKimmey and others have expanded the discussion including similar incidents and histories we are familiar with. >From: Sukie Crandall <[log in to unmask]> >Subject: AFA letter Unfortunately that is the way the AFA has operated since Vickie McKimmey took over as president. Bill was removed from the judge's program because Bill disagreed on some issues with Ms. McKimmey. Actually we have not been told why Bill was removed, but Ms. McKimmey had been threatening to yank Bill's license for several months and we have been told it was because we were not 100% behind Ms. McKimmey. This alleged abuser at the recent NJ show we have learned is in fact one of the senior judges with the AFA and apparently one of those involved with pulling Bill's license. The person involved in the earlier incident at the Warm Fuzzy show that was mentioned indeed Vickie McKimmey. Bill was the person who identified Ms. McKimmey for the other witnesses when they asked me who she was. We were witnesses to some of her actions and now that Bill is not under her control we can openly say that we think what she did at that time was definitely wrong. There was no mistake in identity. Ms. McKimmey referred to one witness who was intimidated into not confirming the identitication. Ms. McKimmey's statment about the reputation of the alleged abuser in the NJ incident is subjective. It is not universally agreed that she has such a good reputation. The treatment given the ferret sounds very much like the manner with which one other officer of the AFA disciplines her ferrets. She has termed it "behavior modification". In our opinion, portions of the AFA has greatly declined. But Lori Barber is indeed doing a great job with the AFR as Sukie pointed out. But the shows have gone downhill. The GCFA, for example, has unamimously voted not to use the AFA anymore to sanction their long running show, over incidents where several judges behaved badly. They have instead opted to use judges removed from the AFA program. More details forth coming in the future. Another example to more clearly understand how Ms. McKimmey and her associates operate is the handling of the recent ADV cases. If anyone saw the posts from their 'secret' ADV list you will better understand the mentality of this group. Several of the messages were put onto the newsgroup news:alt.pets.ferrets and should still be available on Deja. http://www.deja.com They were discussing doing violent and illegal acts to folks that they did not like. Their explanation was that they were kidding about the threats but other members of that list have explicitily stated that they did not see it as anything but purely serious. We became aware of all of this because some members of the list were so frightened they asked us for help. By accepting the role of show sanctioner and show sponsor the AFA did indeed get "hired" by themselves and are indeed responsible for maintaining order. By having "banned" certain vendors and exhibitors the AFA has de facto endorsed all those that they do allow to attend. >From: Debi & David Christy <[log in to unmask]> >Subject: AFA >The way to overthrow a government is from within. If you are proud of your >right to vote, use it. Join the AFA. Insist on policy statements you can >live with. Vote in a president who doesn't get irritated by flaming >emailers. Unfortunately members of the AFA have NO voting privledges. Only the board itself has any votes. Members can nominate people to be officers but those are not counted as votes. There is no working from within to change the AFA. Bill's loss of my AFA judge's license seems to be entirely because we dared to disagree with the leaders. We have longed asked the AFA board to open up voting. We do feel it is necessary to make the officers responsible to the members. Sending email to [log in to unmask] may or may not reach all of the members of the AFA Board. Dr. Freddie Hoffman, Vice-President, is probably not aware of all that is transpiring. She is not very interested in the shows so does not keep up with the details. She is one of the AFA Board members for whom we have great admiration. As we stated in the beginning, we do not have a problem with the AFA in general, only certain officers. We strongly feel changes need to be made in the AFA though so that the AFA can right their course and once again "Promote-Protect-Provide". diane and bill -- bill and diane killian zen and the art of ferrets http://www.zenferret.com/ mailto:[log in to unmask] [Posted in FML issue 3008]