Just read the info Linda got from Dr. Murray. Makes me wonder if any of the foods are mostly sorghum for their starch. Also, makes me wonder about testing urinary pH. Have tested things like water before, but not urine. Anyone here have the low-down on how to do it, what to use? Will water testing strips (available at any pet store in aquarium supplies) work? If it's really affordable like checking water then multiple people could check with the foods they use. (Seems like a neat project for a kid who has a science fair coming up, too, since a pH too high can allow bladder stones form.) Anyway, now I am concerned about rice as well and thinking maybe I had better go through my files for the food comparison site to look at starches and starch percentages. Thanks for the learning opportunity. The more we know, the more we realize that we still have to learn -- having ferrets parrots life in general... There's another point which has been left out in the discussion on the hit ferret: what happens physically with blows to he head or face. I haven't seen the base of a ferret's brain case but in humans there are protuberances there. Now, with a blow, the brain moves around quite a lot (since it normally has a lot of fluid around it to help buffer it) and can grate or bang into structures - not healthy. Sometimes blows to the head or shaking can be fatal or cause permanent injury. Secondly, the bones within the nasal sinus cavities are paper-thin. A blow to the face can injure those -- might even cause scarring or cause the bones to mis-grow. Not good at all. There would also be the risk of injury to other important soft or hard structures. AFA does a lot of things right; I think that there is NO good reason why they should not PROHIBIT the striking or shaking of ferrets, or other forms of abuse at their shows. If you know WHO allowed this to go on, or you know who did it, of both, then you should notify the BOARD MEMBERS of the AFA in writing that you think that their policies on such matters could use review and their rules should be spelled out. It could even be that they already have such regulations in place, and the fault may lie with the individuals rather than the organization. (Don't know; we almost never get a chance to go to shows so haven't been at one for years now.) What was described as having happened should never have happened on many counts -- the abuse, the tolerating of the abuse, the scolding of you for being upset by abuse, and your being pointed out. I can see the individual pointing you out if there was a dispute over whether it ever happened at all and the result of it having happened would be some form of punishment for the hitter since it's always possible that people might make false accusations (something which people here have to always keep in mind, too, when reading reports since at times false ones get sent in), but AS DESCRIBED it was just plain wrong and the AFA needs investigate it as part of a thrust to either firm up policies or make sure that existing anti-abuse policies are followed should they find that it happened as described or even MIGHT have happened as described. That said, take into account that I was NOT there so do NOT actually know what happened, or anything else about it; only know the one report I read gave me this starting point, and that is all -- NOTHING more, nothing confirming, nothing denying for this particular incident, but there have been reports of the rare bout of bad behavior at ferret shows of any type through the years and there must be a platform for dealing with such actions. >It would be so much easier if I could just hold a tissue up to her >nose and tell her "blow." Rachel, you can! They actually take to this quite readily. It's an extension of the normal way they force themselves to sneeze when they want to release musk from the glands behind their ears as part of face-washing. We've found it a very easy thing to teach. To top it off when they get praised for it they like to show off that way, and when you are sitting the animal hospital and run into the occasional "Hurrmph! That's ONLY a ferret." person you can wait a little while, then look at the ferret and say something like, "Oh, you need to blow your nose?" pull out an handkerchief and just blow the mind of the snooty person while your furry calmly and properly blows her nose into the handkerchief... (Don't know how easy it is to teach with paper but cloth works GREAT!) [Posted in FML issue 3005]