>Michelle writes:
>>I wondering what are others opinions on this food it contains apples
>>and carrots everything ive read in my 3 years of ferret ownership
>>says this is not a natural diet.
 
Linda Iroff replies:
>Neither is rice, corn, wheat, potato or a host of other things that
>are  present to some extent is all kibbled diets.
>
>The amount of carrots and apples in these diets is apt to be small.
>I think the important thing to look at is the amount of total
>carbohydrates (which should be low) and the amount of meat based
>protein (which you want high).
 
The hypothesis (not proven for anyone on the FML who is new to this
discussion) that carbohydrates may help set the stage for insulinoma
also calls for taking glycemic index into account.  Some of the veggies
are as high as some of the grains on that score.
 
The fact is that exactly what constitutes a natural diet is too unknown,
so there are no diets which are well based on ancestral wild diets.
Some researchers had thought that the amount of frogs which polecats
take in some areas was due to decreased other game, but recent cladistics
work and some biomechanics work on swimmers indicate that perhaps some
easily acquired aquatic foods such as frogs and some fresh water fish
(many of which do differ in significant ways from marine fish) have/had
long been an important components of ferret ancestral diets.  If that
has/had been the case then none of the kibbled diets (some of which are
largely designed around mimicking the nutritional contents/proportions
of rodents, and some of poultry, and some a mix) and none of what are
called "natural" diets (the foods are natural but that does not mean
that the diets mimic the ancestral diet) really mesh with some nutrient
proportions in the ancestral diet.
 
BTW, links to the suggestive resources (be sure to see Tony Clarke's
Cheshire Wildlife Trust quote) can be found in:
<http://www.smartgroups.com/message/viewdiscussion.cfm?
gid=1423922&messageid=17995>
 and
<http://www.smartgroups.com/message/viewdiscussion.cfm?
gid=1423922&messageid=17936>
 
It is to some extent guess work at this point in time, and I am not
going to say otherwise but instead going to emphasis it, so it's boulder
of salt time, but I figure it always pays to know what is hypothetical
from what is proven so that as actual data change there is a built in
plasticity, and also so that if things so wrong and disappoint there is
less hurt and frustration.  In this case diets of any types themselves
are to some degree possibly shaky and so are the pieces of info which
present some alternatives that need further investigation, as well diet
related hypotheses like the carbohydrate one -- by their very nature of
being hypothetical and therefore unproven.  So, people are best off not
investing themselves emotionally in too many hopes that they build into
beliefs.  We all are better off knowing that we all are just trying our
best with too little information.  Hope itself is okay, but don't take it
over into the realm of belief because that is when good (even wonderful)
people get hurt too badly -- just as too many did when they got too
emotionally invested in beliefs that delaying neutering by 4 or so months
would prevent or delay adrenal growths.  Trying with hope it is fine.
Believing it before it is proven is akin to willingly setting oneself up
as a target for pain.
 
One other point: once you get enough past reproductive ages all bets
come off on what best diets are, with ones that meet the medical needs
of the individuals looking like maybe they could be the very best instead
of going by other criteria, and -- in humans at least -- what suits the
old-old even looking like it could be different from what best suits the
young-old (something -- among others -- that Steve and I have to be a bit
aware about because of still having 6 family members in their 80s and 90s
despite family losses most years in the last decade or so*).
 
The reality of the matter is that all a person can do is to just try
one's best, read the pluses and minuses for each, stay flexible, and
know that as long as person avoids what are known problems and does
one's best that then that is fine and needs to be accepted as nothing
more than a difference of opinion.  It's really all a human can do,
especially while opinions differ markedly due to not enough hard facts
existing.  (And that is a stance which tends to at times get me shouted
at by the most extreme on either side of anything for which there is a
dearth of hard facts when they happen to be on, so, as Elmer Fudd would
endearingly say, "Shhhh!  Let's be quiet as widdle bunnies so they don't
heah us..." Oh, well...)
 
*BTW: not diet but perhaps useful in the future for a number of our
families with older members or memory impaired members:
http://today.uci.edu/news/release_detail.asp?key=1509
 
-- Sukie (not a vet, and not speaking for any of the below in my
private posts)
Recommended health resources to help ferrets and the people who love
them:
Ferret Health List
http://www.smartgroups.com/groups/ferrethealth
FHL Archives
http://ferrethealth.org/archive/
AFIP Ferret Pathology
http://www.afip.org/ferrets/index.html
Miamiferrets
http://www.miamiferret.org/fhc/
International Ferret Congress Critical References
http://www.ferretcongress.org
[Posted in FML issue 5319]