Sukie wrote:
>OR they can get the darkness at other times.

Me:
This time I worded it badly. J I should have said that ferrets need a
nighttimes WORTH of complete darkness.

Sukie:
>One thing to recall with "natural" lighting is that some areas just
>plain no longer even have dark nights.  Much of Australia does, in
>fact, there many city areas are darker at night than much of U.S.
>suburbia.

Me:
We often find that folk from overseas have a very different idea of
what Australia is like compared to how it really is.   The areas in
Australia that have dark nights are the farmlands and mostly
unpopulated areas of the inland deserts of which the country is mostly
comprised.  This is not an area that would be home to many ferrets, so
should not be considered here. Most suburban areas, where the majority
of folk (and their ferrets) live, are subject to 24/7 street lighting
and cities that never close down. (Astronomy clubs still have to
venture far from the suburbs to be able to view the planets properly.)

People who have ferrets in Oz live in housing situations as diverse as
in the US.  They live in apartments, semi-detached housing, caravans
and houses of all sizes.

Sukie:
>Seasonal night lengths vary also according to how close or far any
>person lives to the Equator.  Those MUST be taken into account. Natural is
>not enough, but if one is going to go truly natural in a ferret ancestral
>sense then there need to be really dark areas available DAY AND NIGHT just
>just as they used with their purloined burrows

Me:
This is true in theory, but, during the day, my ferrets mostly eschew
the outdoor burrows and indoor dark sleeping places, instead, choosing
to sleep in brightly lit spots.  I don't know why that is, but think
that their exposure to sunlight or bright daylight means they can
produce melatonin in the relatively dim lighting (nevertheless, not
darkness) that is available at night.   

Sukie: 
>Remember, too, that adrenal disease development except in the very
>elderly is also stopped often by a ferret being whole.  Aren't most of
>yours whole?  In whole ferrets the gonads (missing in neutered ferrets)
>have the ability to send "Quiet down!" signals back to the pituitary and
>reduce the LH and FSH levels back to reasonable levels.  A neutered ferret
>doesn't have that ability.

Me:
>Another misconception.  The vast majority of pet ferrets are neutered,
>albeit not at 8 weeks, but rather at 6 months.  This timing should have no
>bearing on the incidence of adrenal disease because the end results are
>the same.  Of my 21 ferrets in residence, I only have 2 entire females.

Sukie: 
>Also, there is an investigation going on of populations of ferrets
>without adrenal disease to see if there are genetic differences
>involved.  It only involves cheek swabs.  Did you sent ones from your
>crew?  If not, I can put you in touch with  the university research
>team leader, or you can find her contact info in the FML and FHL
>archives by just seekign posts containing "Michelle Hawkins".

Me:
I would love to have the genetics of my ferrets examined, but because I
can't be classed as a breeder, I did not apply.  I do have three
generations of ferrets here, so I shall look into that straight away.

Sukie:
>It's a lot more complicated than what is natural to humans, depending
>on:  ferrets' own ancestral darkness time patterns being different
>from ours and dependent on purloined burrows for much of the time,
>the location of the home, the degree of light pollution, whether the
>ferrets are whole or neutered, and possibly also genetics.

Me:

I couldn't agree more, but what I do find with any type of companion or
captive animal, the further we move from how they were evolved to live,
the more problems arise.  For instance, we now see zoos feeding more
species appropriate meals and providing better habitats and
"hide-aways" to lessen stress.

I think our ferrets deserve as much thought going onto how they are kept and
fed to PREVENT disease rather than trying to repair the damage that is
caused by what is convenient for us.

Shirley

PS  With my endless rambling, I forgot to point out that the whole reason
for my original post was to say that; while ferrets may require ACCESS to
complete darkness, they should not be KEPT in complete darkness 24/7.  That
could be very harmful.

[Posted in FML 5396]