>From:    Paul Ogles <[log in to unmask]>
>Subject: Albino/Cinnamon- long
>The other day I mentioned that I thought the albino/Cinnamon relationship
>had been clearly worked out.  Bill Killian's response suggested that there
>could be 2 albino traits.
 
Oh Fara could easily be wrong.  She was a late comor to the genetics bit
from what I understand.  I know she's wrong on some aspects - but we've all
been wrong and should modify our positions as new information comes in.  I'm
not positive on that for sure.  Sometimes I think its albino and dilute
while others I think its albino/dilute combined.
 
>One final observation.  With all the variation in color ferrets show both
>as individuals in a litter and seasonally, I would not be too surprised if
>a pale Chocolate were mis-classified as a Cinnamon, or a dark Cinnamon as a
>Chocolate.
 
I'm convinced there is enough variation within each color to blur and
confuse everybody.
 
If there is a single albino then I suspect it is a partial dominant or
superdominant to the chocolate color but not to the sable color.  Sable
seems to be dominant to Chocolate.
 
That means is we let F be full color and f be dilute while C be sable color
and c be chocolate.
 
A Sable could be CCFF, CcFF, CCFf or CcFf.  As long as one C and one F are
in there you have a sable.
 
A chocolate could be ccFF only.  Homozygous chocolate and full color.
 
A champagne(cinnamon) could be ccFf.  Chocolate color but heterozygous full
color.
 
An albino would be CCff, Ccff or ccff.  Color doesn't matter as long as the
ferret is homozygous not full color.
 
This would make the albino in ferrets the same as palomino in horses and
blue merle in dogs.
 
There could be an albino that is recessive to both chocolate and sable as
well as a dilute albino gene.  I don't know and go back and forth.  It will
take "testing" to find out - unless someone wants to donate incredible
amounts of money for genetic analysis.  Money better spent elsewhere at this
time.
 
How this superdominant works showing inheritance would be CCFF and CCFF give
only CCFF.  Sable and sable gets sable.  ccFF and ccFF gets only ccFF
chocolates.  So far so simple.  CCFF and CCff which is sable and albino give
only CCFf sables.
 
Sable CCFf and albino CCFf give 25% CCff albino, 50% CCFf sable and 25%
CCFF sable.  This matches everyone experiences.
 
>All I really know is that my own cinnamon/albino crosses have never
>produced anything but variations on those 2 color types.
 
If my guess is right this would be ccFf and ccff giving 50% ccFf champagne
and 50% ccff albino.
 
>Cinnamon appears to be a variant albino.  It only partially limits the
>production of pigment, and the color of the ferret can be patterned, or show
>shade variations depending on what pigment is being limited.
 
This I'm pretty sure is inaccurate.  Patterning is seperate from color and
dilution.
 
If fara is right than champagne and champagne could only give champagne.
This does not match experiences.
 
Her theory would require us to add things.  f' for dilute.  f is albino.  We
can continue with C sable and c chocolate.
 
If Fara is right than Chocolate ccFF and Albino (chocolate) ccff would give
only CcFf chocolates.  If my guess is right it wouldn't.
 
If she's right than champagne and champagne both ccf'f' would give only
ccf'f'.  Now if it was ccf'f and ccf'f you could get ccf'f' and ccf'f
champagnes and ccff albinoes but no chocolates.  This does match our
experience though.
 
All postulation.  So has anyone bred two champagnes (cinnamons) and gotten a
chocolate?  This would disprove Fara.  Has anyone bred an albino from two
dilutes back to a chocolate?  If I'm right that would mean only dilutes.  If
not I'm wrong... Heck I don't know....
 
>By the way, Bill, I haven't received negative feedback for talking about
>breeding here, and since this string was started on the FML I have continued
>it here.  However, I have since joined the Ferret Forum, if you or others
>prefer to move this sort of string to that list.
 
Post length limits are our biggest problem here.  Some folks dont like "any"
breeders but they haven't said anything so far here - that I know of.  This
is fine as long as no objections.
 
bill and diane killian
zen and the art of ferrets
http://www.zenferret.com/
mailto:[log in to unmask]
[Posted in FML issue 1903]