After reminding us that Todd and Caff-Pow were not given raisins but
tried to get them Alex added:
>But apparently, some people have had terrible raisin problems. The
>part that frustrates me is that I can't really find a guideline for
>*how many* raisins might be safe. That gives me pause. I don't feel
>like taking the risk. Ferrets have enough potential health problems
>as it is!

Yes, a set safe number is not known for raisins or grapes. For one
thing there may be differences in kidney health or genetics that
relate to kidneys, and size may matter.

*IF* memory serves (since I don't seem to be able to access the
veterinary article on this at the Ferrets Magazine site) you can find
a series of past posts on this topic from Danee who knows the vets who
authored that article in the FML Archives (address in the header of
each day's Ferret Mailing List, and also in my sig lines). I think
the number that caused kidney failure was something like 7 for one but
about 10 higher for another of the ones treated. Since ferrets stash
there is always a risk that a ferret may eat a number at a time from
a stash.

The dog articles and I think at least one cat article on this can be
found at PubMed, and the ASPCA APCC (Animal Poisoning Control Center)
mentions acute kidney failure in ferrets, cats and dogs from raisins or
grapes in its resources (though sadly it's new location has a terrible
search function).

BTW:
Re: raisin reminder

> http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=33
>
> http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=nutrientprofile&dbid=24

The first in part says:

>Boron for Better Bone Health
>
>Although not often spotlighted in public health recommendations, boron
>is a mineral that is critical to our health, and has been of special
>interest in women in relationship to bone health and osteoporosis
>(bone softening). Boron is a trace mineral required to convert
>estrogen and vitamin D to their most active forms (17-beta- estradiol
>and 1,25-(OH)2D3 respectively).
>...
>Raisins are among the top 50 contributors to total dietary boron in
>the U.S. diet.

So, the more boron in the diet, the more the raw sources for D can be
converted to the active form. I guess that the researchers figure that
perhaps may be enough to make raisins and grapes good for us but bad
for some members of carnivora. Too much Vitamin D3 can be a hazard
for ferrets and dogs though I don't know if it has been looked at in
relation to cat health yet.

It is not yet known how raisins or grapes in high enough amounts cause
acute (sudden) kidney failure in too many ferrets, dogs, and cats, but
many of the more obvious possible causes have been discounted already,
and this is a possible connection mentioned in one past paper as being
studied now.

Sukie (not a vet)

Recommended ferret health links:
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/ferrethealth/
http://ferrethealth.org/archive/
http://www.afip.org/ferrets/index.html
http://www.miamiferret.org/
http://www.ferrethealth.msu.edu/
http://www.ferretcongress.org/
http://www.trifl.org/index.shtml
http://homepage.mac.com/sukie/sukiesferretlinks.html
all ferret topics:
http://listserv.ferretmailinglist.org/archives/ferret-search.html

[Posted in FML 6509]